League starting next week...

Mkay, so just setting down some ideas for the upcoming League…  Guessing I’ll be keeping It as simple as possible. 

1500 points

Standard Book Missions, the same ones for everyone each week.

Will have to come up with an alternate tiebreaker, though USUALLY with Primary and Secondary VCs there is a clear winner in most cases.  Guess it will be a straight number of points killed to be as fair as possible to everyone.

I’m kind of up in the air about allowing people to get in more “free play” games…  My initial thought is no, as it is inherently unfair to the people who can make it there only for the one night/game.  Of course, you COULD get in a few games on Monday, but the weather is likely to get bad again and of course the whole Holiday thing coming up will likely throw in some variance for folks schedules…

Otherwise, I guess the “Standard Local Rules” of FW/whatever being OK as long as it has the 40K stamp…  I will NOT be allowing anything with the “experimental rules” stamp though.  Have to admit I would be VERY much in favor of limiting people to a single FOC, regardless of Allies, etc…  Just getting sick of seeing the 4 Heavy slot armies, or the flying circus silliness… 

Interestingly enough the IA book one reprint is out there and a LOT of the 30K/Heresy stuff in there.  Will be ordering the Escalation book from Dave at the Gopher I think as I have enough of the armies listed in there to make it worth my having.  ‘Course, I’ll be scanning it to have on my wee tablet being one of those silly motorcycle riders.  And seeing things like the Spartan listed with the 40K “official” stamp is a good thing for me…  Ordered one so I’ll have a resin monster tank to be flanked by my ancient original Spartan class Land Raiders.  With the Ceremite Armor upgrade, it is a PITA to stop quickly for most armies…  And it will be painted up in the Grey/Bronze (or copper) with red markings for my VI Legion force/Wolves in 40K… 

In 40K, ironically, a few armies that have fallen out of favor are coming back at least as allies.  The Wolves Rune Priest being the ONLY actual psychic defense that can stop players from casting spells in a large area makes them at least desirable to have around.  Shame there is so little else from the book worth taking.  Grey Knights likewise have the tools necessary to be a good match up against the Eldar and Screamer Stars…  So, it could be that the cycle is coming full circle…

Change of plan, I am running next League... So a short one...

So, the next League will probably be pushed back to February...  So, I'll throw something together to keep the local excitement going I hope.  Looking like a few new books coming out and so a few changes perhaps...

In any case, I am looking at running it as a 1500 point event, I'll match up the participants as best I can and have a transparent long running "tournament" of sorts.  Keeping things pretty simple, I'll have a set mission, terrain setup and deployment so everyone is at least on terms as equal as I can manage.

Still digesting some of the expansion things, so at this point I am thinking that the Eldar/Tau builds are going to remain somewhat overpowered.  Looking over the FW reprint for their Imperial Armor Apoc book...  Looking like there are a LOT of the Heresy Era things that are coming to 40K...  So, Spartan will be fielded at least locally...  And I suspect it will become the norm if I attend Tournaments elsewhere...  No Flare Shield I did notice though :-)  So, the stupidly overpowered things look like they are going away...

Found a good reference picture for my Legion paint scheme...

 So, it appears as if I either saw something like this or simply stumbled upon my current VI/Wolf scheme...

 My own lads are looking frighteningly similar to that...  Just have to figure out the markings will be...  Thinking the red markings will be it.  I never liked the almost Mardi Gras Marine look of he 2nd Edition with the baby blue armor and bright yellow and red markings.  So, I had stripped a LOT of ancient Marines and repainting them like this...  Of course, manufacturing shields for me Siege Breachers to fill in the holes...  It is amazing comparing the modern minis to the ones I have from the 80's...  Damn, some of those ancient minis are craptastic...

Leagues, Expansions and just random "waiting for responses" time killing rants...

So, with the League looking like it will be a start...  Eventually :-)...  Whatever, it is creating some good chatter and looking like it might bring out a fair number of the players.  Guessing again, but I am kind of looking forward to playing my Legion lists against the modern things.  There are some things I am fairly certain that will be difficult to handle but overall I have a fairly strong list.  Strong but I think certainly not overpowered.  Still no fliers of my own, and AV 14 really isn't THAT hard to take down for most forces especially when you realize it is really just 3 Land Raiders, more or less...  But I DO field a LOT of standard Marines or Siege Breachers in the Legion lists I play, and FnP and good Cover/crap Invulnerable saves all around make for a difficult Squad to pull off the table quickly.  Nothing at all subtle, playing the VI Legion the way I used to play my wolves in the ancient times...  Roll straight at them, kill as many as you can and hold what you have taken.  So, pretty much just like I play every army I normally play, FT, Wolves, Eldar, etc...  Except maybe my Praetorian IG...  They are more of a "Hold the Line, Shoot them off the table" sort of Army, not a lot of mobility.

Barring my Legion list?  Well, I have a strong Marine army and my Eldar would be brutally overpowered.  I HAVE the flier now, albeit a paper model a buddy of mine built for me.  I can field a force that can easily take down the annoying Tau lists with either of those I am sure...  Eldar with the WS mounted force are just too good I think but if that's the way the local group wants to go I can...  And with a lot of the forces I am seeing out there it will be at least a fight.  Still, I'd RATHER go with the Legion force and play just for fun. 

My Marine list is a Crimson Fist one so using the Imperial Fist chapter tactics.  Centurion Devastators backed by Hunter AA tank and/or a Thunderfire Cannon for the "base" unit.  Scouts for scoring Troops, maybe Sternguard and Pedro...  Been liking the Storm Raven for a dogfighter/air superiority fighter.  200 points though...  Still, it works really well keeping me at least even with enemy fliers and can also do quite a number on tanks or heavy Infantry it catches in the open.  If I really want to cheese it up I can call it a "3rd Company" list and use the expansion to take the Centurions as Elite instead of Heavy.  Get a slightly different "Bolter Drill" as well....  Frankly I prefer the one in the expansion's drill, but either works well enough for me. 

So, that brings me to the expansions...  As of now, there are six?  It is looking more like the expansions are becoming the norm for the uber competitive forces...  The simple ability to"ally" with your base list and break the FOC is a problem for me.  The extra HQ slot is no big deal, it really seems that the Heavy slot is the problem.  So a legal list with four Riptides is the new rage...  Honestly haven't looked much at the Inquisition or Iron Hands ones...  Not armies I have any interest in playing.  But it appears that the Inquisition book is just a cut and paste rush job.  One of the bigger issues I have with the move to digital is that the local game store sees nothing from these books.  Yes, a few months later they might print limited numbers of physical books that they can jump through the appropriate hoops to buy to maybe sell...  But with the pace of the releases?  Why bother buying the physical book six months late when the next big thing in the power cycle is out?  So, other than the potential extra miniature sales as the latest uber net list hits the tables, nothing for anyone but GW...  And not much of that I'd think frankly...  Not sure what the margins are for a cut and paste PDF, but would think it would be good given the ownership of the original material and the fact that an intern could throw this together in an afternoon...  That and they are REALLY a PITA for tournament play as not everyone would have access to the full rules, so they have to take their opponent at their word as to the interpretation of the few new rules and FOC modifications in each book...  Or the TO has to know them all and keep a watchful eye out for "mistakes" being made.  Might well be honest ones, but when there is money on the table...  Well, have to say I am less enthused about the potential Adepticon trip, and likely will not bother trying to play in that mess.  Looking like at least one more REAL Codex will be out by then, likely 2 and some unknown number of digital supplements to all have the potential of further throwing the game's balance out of whack...  Think I'll just sit back and see what happens.  

So, the unofficial announcement has hit about the fortifications and escalation expansions...  Another wait and see I guess.  Really hoping that the Skyshield is fixed and the rules are cleared up...  But of course, if they are not freely available to everyone, this is a huge problem for me at least...  Having to pay a LOT for broken rules and then having to pay even more to get the fixes?  How very Apple of them.  I know that they will be available via "alternate" methods, and so will VERY likely be dissimulated locally at least (at least the relevant "you need to know the actual rules sections")...  I dunno, thinking of picking up some X-Wing and maybe Malifoux (sp?)...  Just concerned about getting into another "Confrontation" situation where I have huge armies of amazing miniatures for a game system that is dead and gone.  Been burned a few times too many in the past...  Perhaps Warmachine?  Hell, I already HAVE a Cygnar and Circle army from the 1st edition, so a trivial investment...  Maybe :-)...

League coming up, Superheavies and a few pics...

So, looking like a League is starting back up in the Champaign area again…  And with Bill stepping in to run it I do not have to J… Crazy schedule and of course that whole “real life” thing getting in the way…  He is making mention of a painting contest to get things started.  Mkay, repainting my ancient Wolves and I have another squad of the Cataphractii Terminators unassembled to go with the Siege Breachers…  So, nothing is going to be winning any sort of painting competition, but I have a bunch of “painted to tabletop standard” stuff almost ready to go.  Depending on the size of the game I may already have my heavy vehicles assembled…  OK, not the new Spartan…  That will be one thing that I order if there is the money after getting that whole Christmas thing dealt with for Maggie and the girls.  Unless of course someone wants to pick up say, an ancient Lugar or the like cheap(ish)…  And of course there are the issues of whether the locals will allow the use of 30K/Heresy Era lists and whether GW will be pushing out the rumored expansion with “Lords of War” or superheavies.  For the first, we’ve had no problem with them overall, and as I have been “play testing” the exact lists I will be playing in the League (more or less) to good effect overall I think that part will not be an issue. 

Superheavies on the field, and I honestly count the Spartans as an “almost” superheavies, are things that could potentially be a problem for some armies.  With immunity to Melta and 5 Hull Points, the Spartan can be almost impossible for some armies to deal with.  OTOH, it is just a big, expensive dead box for other armies who do not care about AV 14 or the like…  Tau specifically I think will have a horribly difficult time without Eldar allies if they build a…  Let’s call it “tightly focused” army to kill off Marines are going to have almost nothing capable of realistically threatening ANY AV 14, much less the Ceremite plated AV 14 I field…  To be fair though, the AV 14 of the Land Raider has never been all that difficult to get through for the last few editions a least, so most people are simply not bringing them these days.  I however have 2 MK I Land raiders done up as original Spartans to become either Proteus or Phobos Land Raiders.  Depends I guess how I end up going with my Wolves.  But in any case, I can see the addition of big nasties as something that should seriously shake up things from a “meta” build perspective.  Might not, who knows.  Really is a rumor at this point in any case, so nothing solid known.  But with plastic kits to sell for things like IG Baneblades, Ork Stompas, Chaos Khorne blood Zambonis or whatever it is called…  It would be unsurprising to find the game expanding to allow their use and incidentally the increased sales that this would presumably bring.  So, just thinking that the Superheavies are coming, might be a good thing to be ready…  The TL LC is what passes for AA support for my lists at the moment, so having the 4 shots/turn is nice…

So, here's the Cataphractii I have been working on, but having just gotten back from Vegas with Maggie for out Anniversary, not a lot of painting this week...

So, that's what my VI Legion color scheme will be...

Long ramble about the current balance and the local 40K scene...

Ok, got to thinking about some of the more difficult balance issues...  Reading the excellent post on the Jawaballs site (http://warhammer40kbloodangels.blogspot.com/2013/11/mechanicon-2013.html), it kind of crystallized some of how I have been feeling with respect to a lot of the balance issues.  There are some armies that I have that are simply unplayable at the moment.  Well, to be entirely honest, I could PLAY the army, but barring some crazy luck actually winning with the army is nigh impossible.  These days you only hear about people fielding the Wolves as an ally because they still have the 5th edition rules for psychic defenses and some silly over the top powers.  They cannot stand on their own without major support.  Lacking antiaircraft or any Fliers of their own unless you play with Forgeworld as "40K legal" (like we do) they are still a mid 5th ed army that has been passed by... My Fleshtearers are not AS bad in some ways but they were written when the game was very different.  They DO have a single good flyer that can at least dogfight to contest air superiority...  But their HQ elements are now overpriced and the Troops are mediocre at best, despite the large number of potential choices...  Some cannot score, so are useless to win games, others are just expensive Marines who cannot survive the modern environment with Heldrakes, Tau and Eldar out there in force.  The standard Marine was once the measure by which you could compare everything else against, but now I would not bother making that comparison. By and large, all of the 3+ save Codices prior to the current Marine one are vastly overshadowed by the Eldar and Tau.  The current Marine book can at least fight against some of the "net lists" on somewhat even or better footing, but that means tailoring your army to be one element of the Rock-Paper-Scissors...  And therefore just expensive and boring to play.  Or play against.  The game is difficult to justify as a competitive one these days, thus the exodus in many places or the rise in popularity for 30K "Heresy Era" games that we are seeing locally.  Saying that, there were  5-6 games at the Gopher Monday for "40K night"...  So, chances are that locally at least the game is doing well enough after a bit of a lull.  I simply do not have the spare time to run a League well at the moment, and the other guys who in the past ran them have likewise been buried in a similar fashion...

Too many of the current "top tier" armies have a large number of special cases or things which ignore or worse break basic rules of the game.  For instance, the Necron book made an amazing transition to sixth edition with the extremely poorly ported rules for "chariots" and the en masse translation of all of their transports to Fliers from fast skimmers...  Suddenly the perhaps slightly overpriced transport is now a massively under priced monstrosity.  Flying around, deploying Troops precisely on the Field with no risk of deviation, loaded out with pretty decent firepower on their own and with massive defensive bonuses.  And for this ONE Flier, getting shot down has no real ill effect for the embarked Troops, they simply come in on your table edge from Reserves as if nothing happened.  No possibility of casualties (5/6 chance for everyone else), no Pin check, no deploying at a potentially "bad" location to be assaulted immediately...  Just the minor inconvenience of having to walk on to the field.  

The rules for firing at fliers are badly written...  Just my opinion of course, but saying a genetically engineered superhuman with centuries of experience firing advanced weaponry can hit a flier no better than a mindless Ork or untrained conscript with let's call them "less advanced weapons"?  Insane, and clearly not balanced in any way.  As more Codices come out, overall the Fliers are balanced against each other with the glaring exceptions of the Heldrake and the ones "grandfathered in".  The IG Vendetta/Valkyrie and the Necron Croissant of Doom being the big ones.  Ironically, the Marine fliers were massively overpriced before and so seem fairly balanced in the case of the Storm Raven or still overpriced in the case of the Storm Talon.  But saying that, if that's what you have, use it.  I have used both to decent effect as straight out "Air Superiority fighters".  Nothing great, but they at least left me feeling not totally outclassed by what the other player could field, and that is pretty much all I am asking for.

Saying that, the rules, such as they are, for Fortifications are the game breaker for me.  This alone is the main reason I have almost zero interest in trying to get a team together for Adepticon.  Really, the current RAW interpretation for the Skyshield Landing Pad being that it does grant a 3+ cover save as a Fortification in addition to the 4++ save for everything on it against all shooting attacks.  Coupled with a strict RAW interpretation of "Ignores cover" (RAW: Wounds taken, so no effect vs. Vehicles), Eldar Wave Serpents sitting on one covering a Wraith Knight to give 25% cover to it?  Well, the WS has a 2+ cover save that cannot be ignored even if it does not move.  The WK gets a 2+ or 3+ depending and a 4++...  Oh, and nothing can get up there physically to engage in HtH because the whole surface is full.  So, they have a fire base that can pour out SO MUCH fire that most other forces simply melt away...  The only thing I thought of was to drop in a Sternguard Squad or the like and simply target the Building.  But I haven't seen a good ruling for what happens if the Building is "degraded" or destroyed...  Does the fortification lose that status and the ++ save generated by it?  Should, I would think but that is not necessarily the case of course...

So, I have at least one army I feel bad playing...  Eldar.  Simply TOO good these days.  Playing against a mirror force or against the legal but silly ally with yourself things like Tau/Tau or Marine/Marine just does not interest me at all.  Yes, I can build a proxy army using ancient Planetstorm Fantasian Armor, and build the specific Rock to that Scissors, but that REALLY does not interest me at all.  And the actual figures in question...  Sorry, I REALLY do not like them at all.  So, no "GW Official" Tournaments for me it would seem with my Centurion Devastator proxies, despite being WYSIWYG and painted the correct colors :-)  No big deal for me really, I'd be shocked if GW came back to the big tournament scene...  

And saying I have one army too powerful to play, I have 2 that are unplayable in the other direction.  Fleshtearers are a lost cause currently.  Fun to surprise some folks with on a rare occasion, but against all but the silliest and most unbalanced lists they are just bad.  Wolves are being repainted and I am fielding the VI Legion as a Heresy Era force.  They are doing fairly well there, and I am having fun playing that...  Shame that FW can bring out balanced and fun forces while GW fails miserably...  The figures are amazing, but really pricey...  But saying that, the amazing Forgeworld minis are at about the same price point as the new GW Plastics/crap resin stuff.  Maybe FW will be sold through GW's distribution channels and we can get it at the local stores some day, but for now it is mostly beyond my reach...

Veteran Squads out and more Legion "stuff"

Ok, so I’ve tried the Veteran Tactical Squad as Troops a few times…  Have to say I’m not liking it overall.  Yes, occasionally it does some neat things like placing a number of Wounds on say, a Spirit Seer or maybe even rends to get a Glance on a Wave Serpent…  But the Squad cost 270 points + 65 for the Medic for what was essentially a Tactical Squad with 2 Heavy Bolters.  Hiding in a Ruin and lacking real Transport meant that in this case we were pretty much SOL…  I SHOULD have flanked them and had them cause havoc in the Eldar backfield like my 40K Wolves…  Then at least they might have dealt with a few Guardian Squads before they died…  But still, 335 points for 11 Marines is a bit much.  2 of them have Artificer Armor and they have FnP until I lose the Medic, but for that cost I can get 10 Terminator suits onto the field.  And in 30K lists, Terminators ARE scoring units, Troops or no.  So 2+/4++ saves and Power Weapons for everyone seems like a better buy overall.  Fortunate that I happen to HAVE 5 Cataphractii assembled now and another 5 getting ready…  The 10 man Squad with the Spartan as a Dedicated Transport would be an insanely expensive thing, but Scoring Terminators joined by either a Centurion or the Praetor?  Nothing subtle, just rolling across the table to smash things.

But, overall?  I have to say I am liking the Armored Spearhead concept…  Just having a harder time actually fitting in all that I want into the 1850 lists J…  Running multiple Land Raiders is fun, and sometimes even works J…  It IS a surprise for a lot of folks who have not seen them used in a very long time due to the Melta overload in the last edition…  But having a bunch of them immune to Melta rolling across the table?  Not bad I think…  Still need a better way to deal with fliers, but the TL Las Cannons are actually not doing badly for me at the moment.

Guessing I will look at the Siege Breaker again at some point as I am thinking that Artillery might be nice and granting Tank Hunter to a Squad all armed with say, Missile Launchers or the like might be amusing…  And to upgrade the “whole Squad” to Flak missiles is 50 points…  Tank Hunting Flak missiles might be a good “Sky Sweeper” option for me.  340 points for 10 ML seems a bit high, but Interceptor against Deep Strikers means that the Sternguard suicide squad really just does not work well…  I do not know though, this seems a LOT of points given I will likely have to hide them in a Ruin/Bastion or buy them a Rhino.  Might look at the smaller squad in a Bastion?  And/or do I field the Mortis class DN?  The Mortis with the TL Las Cannon the other DA player locally fields seems like it does well, and the Interceptor NOT being limited means that at the least it can put two Las Cannon shots into a lot of things just showing up on the field.  And I have been looking at fielding a Whirlwind Scorpius as Heavy Support…  If the Wolves or any 40K Marine force has access to it, it will likely be one of the longer term purchases for my lads…  Str 8 AP 3 Barrage blast, and if I stand still it is 1 + d3 shots…  THAT could be devastating against parking lots or massed blobs of Heavy Infantry…  Well, NOT Terminator armor, but who plays massed Terminators.  Well, besides me J…

REALLY liking the Siege Breachers Infantry I am putting together...  Will need to trade for more of the "Night Hunter" Wolves decals...  They come something like 10 on the "Wolves" sheet, so I'll have plenty of other ones to give away...

"Pride of the Legion" for this week...

Trying Legion again…  Sticking with my Wolves as VI Legion, and using “Pride of the Legion”…  The disadvantages of “No Allies” and “Lose and extra point if you lose ALL of your Vet/Terminator Squads”…  Eh, if I have lost all of my Troops, I have likely lost big in any case, so nothing for me to be concerned about.  No Allies?  Mkay, I have none in any case in a 30K Environment until I get a specific Legion list and that is a few books down the road.  So, I get to count my Terminators which are scoring in any case but to count them as Troops…  The Veteran Squad getting Sniper is pretty darn cool.  The Heavy Bolter with the suspensor web is another neat thing…  Yes, counting on Rending sucks, but the fact that I can start placing shots onto specific models and every shot is potentially rending…  Not entirely convinced that this is a winning Squad, but it is fun to play.  EXPENSIVE to field, but they should do a fair amount of damage on the table.

So, looking to field:

1850 Legion 11850 Pts  -   ~ Horus Heresy (THH1) Army

1 Legion Praetor (HQ) @ 155 Pts

     Independent Character; Legiones Astartes; Master of the Legion; Rite of

     War: Pride of the Legion; #Cataphractii TDA; Combi-Bolter; Paragon Blade;

     Warlord

1 Forge Lord (Legion Centurion) (HQ) @ 105 Pts

     Independent Character; Legiones Astartes; Consul; Battlesmith; #Frag

     Grenades; #Krak Grenades; #Artificer Armour; Rad Grenades; Bolt Pistol

     (x1); Charnabal Sabre; Servo-arm

4 Legion Terminator Squad (Troops) @ 485 Pts

     Legiones Astartes; Implacable Advance; Prototype Weaponry; #Cataphractii

     TDA; Chainfist (x1); Lightning Claws (x2) (x1); Power Weapon (x2);

     Combi-Bolter (x2); Reaper Autocannon (x1)

     1 Legion Terminator Sergeant @ [55] Pts

          #Cataphractii TDA; Combi-Bolter; Power Weapon (x1)

     1 Legion Phobos @ [270] Pts

          Vehicle (Tank); Capacity: 10; Access Points: 3; Assault Vehicle;

          #Searchlight; #Smoke Launchers; #Machine Spirit; Armoured Ceremite;

          TL Lascannon Sponsons (x2)

9 Legion Veteran Tactical Squad (Troops) @ 270 Pts

     Legiones Astartes; Veteran Tactics; Power Armour; Chainsword (x8); Bolt

     Pistol (x9); Bolter (x7); Heavy Bolter w/Suspensor Web (x2); Power Weapon

     (x1); Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades

     1 Legion Veteran Sergeant @ [85] Pts

          (character); Artificer Armour; Bolt Pistol; Power Weapon (x1); Bolter

19 Legion Breacher Siege Squad (Troops) @ 395 Pts

     Legiones Astartes; Hardened Armour; #Boarding Shield; Power Armour; Bolt

     Pistol (x19); Bolter (x15); Flamer (x2); Graviton Gun (x2); Frag Grenades;

     Krak Grenades

     1 Legion Sergeant @ [155] Pts

          (character); #Boarding Shield; Artificer Armour; Bolter; Power Weapon

          (x1)

1 Legion Apothecary (Elites) @ 125 Pts

     (character); Legiones Astartes; #Narthecium; Augury Scanner; Artificer

     Armour; Bolt Pistol; Power Sword; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades

     1 Legion Apothecary #1 @ [55] Pts

          (character); Legiones Astartes; #Narthecium; Artificer Armour;

          Chainsword; Bolt Pistol; Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades

1 Legion Spartan Assault Tank (Heavy Support) @ 315 Pts

     Vehicle (Tank); Capacity: 25; Access Points: 3; Assault Vehicle; #Machine

     Spirit; #Extra Armour; #Searchlight; #Smoke Launchers; Armoured Ceremite;

     TL Heavy Bolters; Quad Lascannon Sponsons (x2)

Models in Army: 41

Total Army Cost: 1850

So, another REALLY simple force…  Essentially, the Spartan loaded up with the Breachers, the Praetor, the Forge Lord and a Medic to give them all FnP.  Immune to Melta, roll forward and hopefully take an objective.  The second Raider runs as “security” or as a “wingman” to the primary force…  Break off if needed, but looking at the Tau/Eldar MC builds.  6 TL Las Cannon to fire each turn, the Vets with Sniper sitting back and camping an Objective.  With the FAQ allowing Cataphractii Terminator armor NOT preventing a squad from funning down someone beaten in HtH…  Yes, the Breachers are REALLY unlikely to ever do this with the complete lack of HtH ability and -1” on the attempt….  But still J…  Initiative 5 with the Praetor/Forge Lord and the number of CC monsters “hidden” in the giant Squad makes for a very real threat…  Loads of weird special rules like Rad Grenades, Defensive Grenades, etc…  But in general, we roll up and shoot…  A LOT.  Hope for the best and hope that you simply outlast the other side…