Wolves are doing "OK", and I may well use them next week. I DO like the Wolf Priest mit Jaeger saga, and Wolf Scouts I think will also do well enough to justify their being fielded... Will still get murdered by aircraft though... Might even stop raining by then so I can ride my bike out...
Looking at breaking out my old Crimson Fist force:
Pedro Kantor
Scout Squad (5, shotguns, Heavy Bolter)
Scout Squad (10, cloaks, 9 snipers, Heavy Bolter)
Sternguard (10, 2 Heavy Flamers, 6 Combi Melta, 2 Combi Plasma, SGT w/LC, Drop Pod)
Thunderfire Cannon
and ?
Thinking Land Speeder Storm for the Shotgun squad and maybe an Attack Bike? I could drop the one Scout Squad to 5 men and take a Vindicator or the like I guess... Liking the ability to drive forward and drop the big Str 10 AP 1 Ord template... Might come in handy for 125 points... Still have 55 points, not sure what non useless thing I can get...
Low model count army, and the bulk of the actual Troops are just regular Scouts... Too many things these days taking away the cover save, so might go "poorly", but might actually work... OTOH, Scoring Sternguard can be brutal dropping in on someone and combat squadding...
Thursday, April 18, 2013
Tuesday, April 16, 2013
Game play issues, long random post :-)
Mkay, kind of just killing time before next meeting, so...
Wondering if I am missing something, but there seems to be some things that just do not make sense to me...
Comparing Chaos to Loyalist Terminators. Chaos has by default the "Combi Bolter", so twin linked bolter. Loyalists have the "Storm Bolter". Combi Bolter, looking at the math, I get one shot at >12" to 24" range that hits something like 90% of the time (8/9). Storm Bolter for out to 24" range has the Assault 2, so 2 shots at the usual BS 4. Been a while since I took Statistics or Math, but I'm thinking the odds of at least one hit are (1 - [1/3*1/3]) or 8/9... The same odds for a single hit from the Combi Bolter... Getting TWO hits, your odds are somewhat worse, so 4/9? The Loyalist weapon is slightly better for that range bracket, but within 12" range when the Combi Bolter fires twice with twin linking? The Chaos version is clearly superior at the shorter range bracket, and enough so that I would question why I would want to ever run a Storm Bolter over a Combi Bolter. Mind, the reality is both are pretty crap weapons in the grander scheme, but on a Terminator at least I do have to question why I would go away from the working version to one that may be slightly better at longer range, but clearly worse where the bulk of my shooting actually occurs? Started thinking about this looking at my Wolves where I CAN get a bunch of Combi weapons, though not a Combi Bolter. For balance I can see why GW would not change the SB rules given the Grey Knights and the huge mass of them they could field on "non Terminator" models... Would I pay a few more points to swap CB for SB? Maybe... I DO think it should have been a default option, to allow the Loyalists to keep the CB over the SB if they want...
Keeping on the Terminator weapons, I've previously gone over how I feel about the once mighty Assault Cannon... Currently, 4 shots is nice, but needing a 6 on the to wound/armor penetration roll to do much of anything makes it "less useful" as far as I am concerned. Str 6 AP 4 just doesn't cut it these days especially given the 24" range and the Rending shots are still just AP 4, and so less likely to actually destroy a Vehicle rolling on the chart vs. taking hull points... And since I'm looking for 6's a lot of the time anyway to do anything to Vehicles... Needs a range boost, Str boost and something helping with Vehicles... Until then, I cannot see paying an additional 30 points and giving up the (admittedly crap) Storm Bolter for the "gee, I hope I roll lots of 6's" weapon. In general the new Assault Cannon compares unfavorably to the "older" Reaper class Autocannon. Once again, fewer shots, but in this case higher Str and 50% greater range? Yes, loses Rending, so cannot ever actually touch AV 14... OK. But I think I'd rather be able to ping lighter armor more regularly... And of course the extra range would be really nice...
Cyclone took a hit as well, though it is still useful. AP 3 makes the Krak missiles less useful for taking down vehicles, but they still actually kill Marines, so... Not TOO bad, but when compared to some of the more modern choices, it is simply overpriced. But this and the Heavy Flamer are the ones that seem close enough to actually use...
Thunder Hammer/Storm Shield... With the game going away from HtH, not nearly so useful I think. Giving up all shooting attacks is bad, but the 3++ and "I Don't Care" weapon... Worth 45 points on a Terminator. Worth 63? No. Wolves get to customize the hell out of their Terminators, but we do have to pay a really heavy cost to do so. Lightning Claws are 48 points on either Terminator or Powered Armor... Yeah, the LC are slightly better than "Vanilla" ones, but all of the LC took a pretty serious hit in the age of AP on powered weapons... NOT so bad a hit as the "Power Maul" of course... AP 4 on a Powered Weapon? Tre' Craptastic. AND the fact that all of my Chaplain types are stuck with it? Why? Why would I field a standard weapon incapable of actually punching through Powered Armor? Yes, Str 6 so it is not complete crap, but really? Playing a lot with Wolf Priests in my force and finding them losing combats because they cannot ignore 3+ armor...
:-) Mkay, mostly unfocused free riffs there, but a start I think...
Wondering if I am missing something, but there seems to be some things that just do not make sense to me...
Comparing Chaos to Loyalist Terminators. Chaos has by default the "Combi Bolter", so twin linked bolter. Loyalists have the "Storm Bolter". Combi Bolter, looking at the math, I get one shot at >12" to 24" range that hits something like 90% of the time (8/9). Storm Bolter for out to 24" range has the Assault 2, so 2 shots at the usual BS 4. Been a while since I took Statistics or Math, but I'm thinking the odds of at least one hit are (1 - [1/3*1/3]) or 8/9... The same odds for a single hit from the Combi Bolter... Getting TWO hits, your odds are somewhat worse, so 4/9? The Loyalist weapon is slightly better for that range bracket, but within 12" range when the Combi Bolter fires twice with twin linking? The Chaos version is clearly superior at the shorter range bracket, and enough so that I would question why I would want to ever run a Storm Bolter over a Combi Bolter. Mind, the reality is both are pretty crap weapons in the grander scheme, but on a Terminator at least I do have to question why I would go away from the working version to one that may be slightly better at longer range, but clearly worse where the bulk of my shooting actually occurs? Started thinking about this looking at my Wolves where I CAN get a bunch of Combi weapons, though not a Combi Bolter. For balance I can see why GW would not change the SB rules given the Grey Knights and the huge mass of them they could field on "non Terminator" models... Would I pay a few more points to swap CB for SB? Maybe... I DO think it should have been a default option, to allow the Loyalists to keep the CB over the SB if they want...
Keeping on the Terminator weapons, I've previously gone over how I feel about the once mighty Assault Cannon... Currently, 4 shots is nice, but needing a 6 on the to wound/armor penetration roll to do much of anything makes it "less useful" as far as I am concerned. Str 6 AP 4 just doesn't cut it these days especially given the 24" range and the Rending shots are still just AP 4, and so less likely to actually destroy a Vehicle rolling on the chart vs. taking hull points... And since I'm looking for 6's a lot of the time anyway to do anything to Vehicles... Needs a range boost, Str boost and something helping with Vehicles... Until then, I cannot see paying an additional 30 points and giving up the (admittedly crap) Storm Bolter for the "gee, I hope I roll lots of 6's" weapon. In general the new Assault Cannon compares unfavorably to the "older" Reaper class Autocannon. Once again, fewer shots, but in this case higher Str and 50% greater range? Yes, loses Rending, so cannot ever actually touch AV 14... OK. But I think I'd rather be able to ping lighter armor more regularly... And of course the extra range would be really nice...
Cyclone took a hit as well, though it is still useful. AP 3 makes the Krak missiles less useful for taking down vehicles, but they still actually kill Marines, so... Not TOO bad, but when compared to some of the more modern choices, it is simply overpriced. But this and the Heavy Flamer are the ones that seem close enough to actually use...
Thunder Hammer/Storm Shield... With the game going away from HtH, not nearly so useful I think. Giving up all shooting attacks is bad, but the 3++ and "I Don't Care" weapon... Worth 45 points on a Terminator. Worth 63? No. Wolves get to customize the hell out of their Terminators, but we do have to pay a really heavy cost to do so. Lightning Claws are 48 points on either Terminator or Powered Armor... Yeah, the LC are slightly better than "Vanilla" ones, but all of the LC took a pretty serious hit in the age of AP on powered weapons... NOT so bad a hit as the "Power Maul" of course... AP 4 on a Powered Weapon? Tre' Craptastic. AND the fact that all of my Chaplain types are stuck with it? Why? Why would I field a standard weapon incapable of actually punching through Powered Armor? Yes, Str 6 so it is not complete crap, but really? Playing a lot with Wolf Priests in my force and finding them losing combats because they cannot ignore 3+ armor...
:-) Mkay, mostly unfocused free riffs there, but a start I think...
Grey Hunters for the win, but...
Played Wolves last night again... Partner and I both brought a single HQ and only Troops... So, Grey Hunters. Lots and lots of Jaegers... I fielded my Wolf Priest and a foot squad to take advantage of the flanking move he gives them with Saga of Jaeger... One full squad in Rhino and two in Razorbacks... Fully loaded out with options for power weapons, MotW, special weapons, etc...
We won the game based on setup... 5 objectives, we had 3 in our dz, they castled to avoid my partner's drop pod assault... He brought 3 pods :-) .... And my flankers to distract... They tried to pry us off of one objective, but my Razorback protected the squad and allowed us to counter drop and kill their assault force. After that it was mostly cleanup... They killed my flankers eventually, but the Priest held for several HtH rounds, buying valuable time and holding their fast reaction forces in place... So, heavy losses but playing the mission won the game...
Course, no enemy fliers or heavy armor... Wolves are still solid Infantry, and loaded out they match well against enemy assault specialists... I'm not at all convinced that an army built to take down MEQ Infantry wouldn't just destroy my lads in detail. The Tau in particular seem quite suited for this, as are/were the IG and GK that are popular locally. Chaos, with the exception of the Heldrake I think I could match well against. That however... Flanking tricks, going back to mostly Mech... Helps, but I think that someone who builds their Chaos force right will tear my Wolves up.
DA are such a low model count army for me that I think they will not be able to hold in the long term given the modern volume of fire. I WILL roll 1's eventually :-)... So, they are a "neat" niche army for me, rotating them back to the shelf I think.
IG? Yeah... Just got the new bike, and smaller saddlebags than the old Cruiser's hard luggage... The backpack I could probably bring a fair sized force with, but... :-) The force would be a hard one to pack onto the bike... Amusing, but... Guess I'll see what I end up getting repainted before having to re watch "Zulu" for inspiration...
So, leaves my Fleshtearers and Crimson Fists... Until the Tau, I would have said the BA Codex was still decent, if used aggressively... Now? I am honestly concerned about the amount of "Intercept", Marker Light silliness and Overwatch they have access to... I'm just not seeing a rosy future for any army counting on Assault... Fausts? Well, lots of scoring units, but still mostly just 3+ armor... One shot with the suicide drop pods, if it works, it works REALLY well, else... Well :-) A short game in any case...
We won the game based on setup... 5 objectives, we had 3 in our dz, they castled to avoid my partner's drop pod assault... He brought 3 pods :-) .... And my flankers to distract... They tried to pry us off of one objective, but my Razorback protected the squad and allowed us to counter drop and kill their assault force. After that it was mostly cleanup... They killed my flankers eventually, but the Priest held for several HtH rounds, buying valuable time and holding their fast reaction forces in place... So, heavy losses but playing the mission won the game...
Course, no enemy fliers or heavy armor... Wolves are still solid Infantry, and loaded out they match well against enemy assault specialists... I'm not at all convinced that an army built to take down MEQ Infantry wouldn't just destroy my lads in detail. The Tau in particular seem quite suited for this, as are/were the IG and GK that are popular locally. Chaos, with the exception of the Heldrake I think I could match well against. That however... Flanking tricks, going back to mostly Mech... Helps, but I think that someone who builds their Chaos force right will tear my Wolves up.
DA are such a low model count army for me that I think they will not be able to hold in the long term given the modern volume of fire. I WILL roll 1's eventually :-)... So, they are a "neat" niche army for me, rotating them back to the shelf I think.
IG? Yeah... Just got the new bike, and smaller saddlebags than the old Cruiser's hard luggage... The backpack I could probably bring a fair sized force with, but... :-) The force would be a hard one to pack onto the bike... Amusing, but... Guess I'll see what I end up getting repainted before having to re watch "Zulu" for inspiration...
So, leaves my Fleshtearers and Crimson Fists... Until the Tau, I would have said the BA Codex was still decent, if used aggressively... Now? I am honestly concerned about the amount of "Intercept", Marker Light silliness and Overwatch they have access to... I'm just not seeing a rosy future for any army counting on Assault... Fausts? Well, lots of scoring units, but still mostly just 3+ armor... One shot with the suicide drop pods, if it works, it works REALLY well, else... Well :-) A short game in any case...
Thursday, April 11, 2013
Ah, hobby funk...
Yeah, a bit annoyed in general... Guess I'm just not really finding I am enjoying 40K as much as I think I should be. More or less cycled through my older armies, though I have not fielded my Praetorians or Eldar much... Opposite problems there, the Eldar are at the moment hopelessly outclassed by the modern stuff and the IG are more powerful than ever I think. Now, one of the locals who is actually a really good player argues that the Valkyrie/Vendetta (though honestly, who has ever seen them fielded as anything other than a Vendetta for the 3 x TLLC?) is actually not overpowered, in fact severely overrated... Me, I come down on the other side of that argument as the Ven can do a LOT for it's 130 or so points, remain virtually immune to counterfire and be taken in such numbers as to just be silly... SO much cheaper than the modern DA/Marine fliers and while it does only have BS 2, the main weapons are twin linked and freaking Las Cannons! So, the AV 11 that is fairly standard on most modern fliers is just tissue paper really, and the Ven should down one enemy flier/turn on average rolls... Yes, it might well have issues taking down a wall of AV 14 tanks, but why bother? They do not score, just kill every Chimera then start shooting the smaller squads of Infantry that survive the explosions... The Transport capability, while neat, I think is really not necessary to the current environment... Saying that though, I can easily put the Platoon Command Squad with 4 flamers in there as a Scoring unit that I can air drop in if needed... A bit risky, or I can just hover the flier for the late game objective grab or toast up something that is packed in behind say, an Aegis line...
And, yes, I HAVE a Vendetta... Well, I magnetized the weapon load out, so could easily have either... It just feels "unfun" to play that, especially the way I'd play my IG "Light Rifles" company... Not really "light" or "rifles" :-) but... The Artillery in the form of a Basilisk and Colossus (IIRC, the Str 6, AP 3 no cover save one) as separate units... Probably a LR Vanquisher as a third Heavy. Having faced them, screened and screening my Artillery, I think it would be a terrifying thing... One Company Command squad with the Artillery officer at least, PCS to fly around... At least one big Platoon to mob up and screen the Arty. Heavy Weapons teams to set up and take pot shots and keep the Enemy honest... SO many shots outbound... Even at BS 3, should be quite good... Like I said, probably too good...
That's just it... Barring severely bad luck, it is a REALLY powerful army. Not unbeatable by any means, but at such a severe advantage against all but the over the top Necron flying circus... And even that I think has to be VERY careful...
Though, there are some interesting Kickstarters out there: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/649754189/28mm-steampunk-inspired-heavy-weapons-and-carriage?ref=users Looks neat, and VERY much in line with the Praetorians I have... I'll be keeping an eye on this, but with the motorcycle being picked up tomorrow... Money is a bit tighter until I sell the old bike...
So, getting a 1996 Honda Magna... 750cc engine, V4... So a bit more powerful than the Silverwing...
And, yes, I HAVE a Vendetta... Well, I magnetized the weapon load out, so could easily have either... It just feels "unfun" to play that, especially the way I'd play my IG "Light Rifles" company... Not really "light" or "rifles" :-) but... The Artillery in the form of a Basilisk and Colossus (IIRC, the Str 6, AP 3 no cover save one) as separate units... Probably a LR Vanquisher as a third Heavy. Having faced them, screened and screening my Artillery, I think it would be a terrifying thing... One Company Command squad with the Artillery officer at least, PCS to fly around... At least one big Platoon to mob up and screen the Arty. Heavy Weapons teams to set up and take pot shots and keep the Enemy honest... SO many shots outbound... Even at BS 3, should be quite good... Like I said, probably too good...
That's just it... Barring severely bad luck, it is a REALLY powerful army. Not unbeatable by any means, but at such a severe advantage against all but the over the top Necron flying circus... And even that I think has to be VERY careful...
Though, there are some interesting Kickstarters out there: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/649754189/28mm-steampunk-inspired-heavy-weapons-and-carriage?ref=users Looks neat, and VERY much in line with the Praetorians I have... I'll be keeping an eye on this, but with the motorcycle being picked up tomorrow... Money is a bit tighter until I sell the old bike...
So, getting a 1996 Honda Magna... 750cc engine, V4... So a bit more powerful than the Silverwing...
Tuesday, April 9, 2013
Ever have one of those games?
:-) Where EVERYTHING that could go wrong did? Played partnered up with a DA player who brought a Ravenwing force... Seemed a fairly decent one, I'm still unconvinced that the Black Knights are at all worth it, but on paper they look neat... So, I had my Scouts behind enemy lines and my big Grey Hunter squad flanked with a Wolf Guard in Termi Armor and the Wolf Priest (who I had upgraded to Runic Armor)... They both arrived on Turn 2, catching the enemy in their DZ lining up for some REALLY good rear arc shots... Scouts missed with everything but the Plasma Pistol, which failed to penetrate the 11 Armor. Next turn they were wiped out by a single weapon... The Grey Hunters, despite a LOT of Preferred Enemy shooting, several Meltas, Plasma, etc... Hit a Tau skimmer with a 4+ cover save... All told with insane rolling on his part, a single HP got through (a Bolter glance). Next turn the squad dropped to 2 Grey Hunters and the Priest... Who split off and charged a separate unit as the Jaegers got shot out of existence on overwatch fire... Oh, and after their lone flier came in to wipe out 1 squad/turn for both turns it was there my sole remaining model, a Razorback decided to suicide by doing 2 HP to ITSELF... Twin linked Plasma Gun missed twice, snake eyes on re-roll followed by 2 fails on the "Gets Hot"... Yea. Perfect ending for that game though :-) If you are going to fail, do so in an epic fashion...
Mostly a lot of bad dice on our side and really good dice on theirs... Am thinking the Tau are going to be a powerful force though... A LOT of twin linking, and the ability to "cover" each other with a metric crapload of overwatch fire makes charging with small units a difficult thing... I think it will matter much less against a large force or one with really good defenses, etc...
Still having NO defenses against a flier for my Wolves really I think hurt almost as much as the failed end run... With complete impunity the IG flier was able to just roll in, destroy one small squad/turn and there was nothing at all I could realistically do to prevent it... Wonder if I will have to run a Land Raider or a Bastion to sit my AAA in... Might wind up running the Raider just to see...
Mostly a lot of bad dice on our side and really good dice on theirs... Am thinking the Tau are going to be a powerful force though... A LOT of twin linking, and the ability to "cover" each other with a metric crapload of overwatch fire makes charging with small units a difficult thing... I think it will matter much less against a large force or one with really good defenses, etc...
Still having NO defenses against a flier for my Wolves really I think hurt almost as much as the failed end run... With complete impunity the IG flier was able to just roll in, destroy one small squad/turn and there was nothing at all I could realistically do to prevent it... Wonder if I will have to run a Land Raider or a Bastion to sit my AAA in... Might wind up running the Raider just to see...
Monday, April 8, 2013
This week's 1k list... Wolves again...
So, looking at bringing the following:
Wolf Priest (Saga of the Hunter, has the 4++, Power Mace)
Grey Hunters (10, Plasma Pistol, Power Weapon, Flamer, Melta, MotW, Banner)
Grey Hunters (5, Razorback w/LC TLPG, Flamer, MotW)
Grey Hunters (5, Razorback w/ TLAC, Flamer, MotW)
Long Fangs (5, 3 ML, HB, SGT)
Wolf Guard (3, Combi Melta, PW?)
Wolf Scouts (Melta)
So, for 1000 points, a lot of bodies and even 2 light tank/transports... Counting on Flank/Behind Enemy Lines to deliver a lot of the lads where they need to go and frankly NOT be on the table getting shot up from the beginning... I'm not really liking the "light" Wolf Scouts, I'd like to throw some more points in there for things like MotW, a few Melta Bombs and Plasma Pistols, but the low points is REALLY a limiting factor here. Guessing they'll be a "line breaker" unit and something to try for a tank/camping unit kill... Still, just 5 guys in 4+ armor, so not something I'd be banking on. I'm much more confident in the 10 man Grey Hunter squad with attached Wolf Guard and Wolf Priest Outflanking. With the now mostly useless "senses", they'll likely come in on the side I want, and 12 guys fully kitted out in actual Powered Armor along with a few Characters to take challenges as needed... Well, guessing it will work out at least once before folks start putting their stuff in the center of the field to avoid my lads... Screens will work too, but really not so sure how often I'll be seeing them here locally for now... Gone are the days of IG "blobs" simply lining the DZ to keep out flankers. More realistic concern is that I may run into an IG (or other) tank parking lot and be unable to get to the important things, perhaps just hitting a Rhino/Chimera before getting shot out of existence... So, like I said, this thing I think has a limited number of uses before the locals at least react and have very solid plans to deal with my one trick Army...
Still, ~20 points left over... I can get Runic Armor for the Priest, I guess 2+ would be nice for him, just not so sure how often really... Another HB Long Fang would fit nicely, or perhaps a Plasma Pistol and Melta Bomb for the Scouts? Leaning toward more offensive firepower (Plasma Pistol/Melta), but the 2+/4++ might just give the Jaegers the staying power to win me some games... Doing the math however, I look better putting the Terminator Armor on the Wolf Guard as it comes to the same bloody point cost as I had them originally... +5 points to change the SB to Combi Weapon... So, that and Plasma Pistol in the Scouts I guess...
With enough more points of course, the Wolf Guard would have 5 members and one would be kitted out with Terminator Armor and a CML to get himself attached to the Long Fangs... Would likely also have the Flankers joined by a WG in Terminator Armor for the Combi Weapon and Power Weapon... They are prohibited from joining the Scouts in Terminator Armor, but nothing prevents Grey Hunters as far as I can see... Seems a bit silly, bulky Terminator Armor being snuck around to hit a flank, but no more silly than the Legion that used to be "Planetary Assault Specialists" now fearing teleporters and Jump Packs... So, at least I have the framework for 1500-1850 point games... We mostly play 1850 locally, so most of what I do is with that level in mind... Guessing my Heavies get the Vindicator and maybe a Predator? 2 Long Fang squads is neat, but with so bloody many of the Heldrakes locally, they simply cannot do heir jobs anymore... Elite might well get a DN... The TLAC mount is pretty stable, and will almost always put 3 Str 7 hits on target... May well never actually kill anything with AP 4, but light vehicles and maybe even light fliers may well be worried... I've never really been a fan of Lone Wolves, and ALWAYS bring Wolf Guard, so my Elites are pretty well set. Fast Attack? Eh... While I liked fielding my Rackham/Confrontation Wolfen as "Thunderwolf Cavalry, I see way too much locally that will just shoot them off the board. I can only make so many 3+/3++ saves... Speeders I have, and if I really feel like resurrecting one or three... "Eh" again. So fragile. I always joked they were my "guided missiles", and the new edition has really solidified that opinion for me... Bike squad? Maybe... Still not liking the silly shooting restriction, BS/WS 3 and higher cost overall... The Attack bike is cheap, but you get what you pay for. Worse than IG crew... Eh. The Land Raider as either a dedicated transport for the Wolf Guard or just a Heavy on it's own might be amusing... If I didn't regularly see 2-3 LR Vanquishers in several of the IG lists locally, the "Death Ray" weren't so bloody good, or there was some realistic defense against someone just dropping Melta on top of my position I could see bringing the 250+ point vehicle. I like them, I really do... Just that even with 4 HP, they mostly just die to Melta appearing before they really get rolling or do much of anything. Yes, I did the DA LR of silliness with the (for them ) IC Techmarine giving the 4++ save and repairs from inside the vehicle... DAMN expensive and while it usually worked for what it was, there were several instances of if simply being killed by say, a Necron Chariot fly by... Lacking however the IC status on my bloody Iron Priest and the 4++ save? Not yet... Maybe in a big enough game where I can realistically protect the tank...
OK, enough random long term planning, back to the game at hand... Still not a lot of heavy anti tank, nor do I really have an answer for the fliers other than trying to outlast them... I do think with the limits in the league I WILL have enough AT firepower, it is mostly the AAA that I am concerned about... Though I guess I can hope they bring an Aegis line and just walk on to steal the gun... Or that time runs out...
Wolf Priest (Saga of the Hunter, has the 4++, Power Mace)
Grey Hunters (10, Plasma Pistol, Power Weapon, Flamer, Melta, MotW, Banner)
Grey Hunters (5, Razorback w/LC TLPG, Flamer, MotW)
Grey Hunters (5, Razorback w/ TLAC, Flamer, MotW)
Long Fangs (5, 3 ML, HB, SGT)
Wolf Guard (3, Combi Melta, PW?)
Wolf Scouts (Melta)
So, for 1000 points, a lot of bodies and even 2 light tank/transports... Counting on Flank/Behind Enemy Lines to deliver a lot of the lads where they need to go and frankly NOT be on the table getting shot up from the beginning... I'm not really liking the "light" Wolf Scouts, I'd like to throw some more points in there for things like MotW, a few Melta Bombs and Plasma Pistols, but the low points is REALLY a limiting factor here. Guessing they'll be a "line breaker" unit and something to try for a tank/camping unit kill... Still, just 5 guys in 4+ armor, so not something I'd be banking on. I'm much more confident in the 10 man Grey Hunter squad with attached Wolf Guard and Wolf Priest Outflanking. With the now mostly useless "senses", they'll likely come in on the side I want, and 12 guys fully kitted out in actual Powered Armor along with a few Characters to take challenges as needed... Well, guessing it will work out at least once before folks start putting their stuff in the center of the field to avoid my lads... Screens will work too, but really not so sure how often I'll be seeing them here locally for now... Gone are the days of IG "blobs" simply lining the DZ to keep out flankers. More realistic concern is that I may run into an IG (or other) tank parking lot and be unable to get to the important things, perhaps just hitting a Rhino/Chimera before getting shot out of existence... So, like I said, this thing I think has a limited number of uses before the locals at least react and have very solid plans to deal with my one trick Army...
Still, ~20 points left over... I can get Runic Armor for the Priest, I guess 2+ would be nice for him, just not so sure how often really... Another HB Long Fang would fit nicely, or perhaps a Plasma Pistol and Melta Bomb for the Scouts? Leaning toward more offensive firepower (Plasma Pistol/Melta), but the 2+/4++ might just give the Jaegers the staying power to win me some games... Doing the math however, I look better putting the Terminator Armor on the Wolf Guard as it comes to the same bloody point cost as I had them originally... +5 points to change the SB to Combi Weapon... So, that and Plasma Pistol in the Scouts I guess...
With enough more points of course, the Wolf Guard would have 5 members and one would be kitted out with Terminator Armor and a CML to get himself attached to the Long Fangs... Would likely also have the Flankers joined by a WG in Terminator Armor for the Combi Weapon and Power Weapon... They are prohibited from joining the Scouts in Terminator Armor, but nothing prevents Grey Hunters as far as I can see... Seems a bit silly, bulky Terminator Armor being snuck around to hit a flank, but no more silly than the Legion that used to be "Planetary Assault Specialists" now fearing teleporters and Jump Packs... So, at least I have the framework for 1500-1850 point games... We mostly play 1850 locally, so most of what I do is with that level in mind... Guessing my Heavies get the Vindicator and maybe a Predator? 2 Long Fang squads is neat, but with so bloody many of the Heldrakes locally, they simply cannot do heir jobs anymore... Elite might well get a DN... The TLAC mount is pretty stable, and will almost always put 3 Str 7 hits on target... May well never actually kill anything with AP 4, but light vehicles and maybe even light fliers may well be worried... I've never really been a fan of Lone Wolves, and ALWAYS bring Wolf Guard, so my Elites are pretty well set. Fast Attack? Eh... While I liked fielding my Rackham/Confrontation Wolfen as "Thunderwolf Cavalry, I see way too much locally that will just shoot them off the board. I can only make so many 3+/3++ saves... Speeders I have, and if I really feel like resurrecting one or three... "Eh" again. So fragile. I always joked they were my "guided missiles", and the new edition has really solidified that opinion for me... Bike squad? Maybe... Still not liking the silly shooting restriction, BS/WS 3 and higher cost overall... The Attack bike is cheap, but you get what you pay for. Worse than IG crew... Eh. The Land Raider as either a dedicated transport for the Wolf Guard or just a Heavy on it's own might be amusing... If I didn't regularly see 2-3 LR Vanquishers in several of the IG lists locally, the "Death Ray" weren't so bloody good, or there was some realistic defense against someone just dropping Melta on top of my position I could see bringing the 250+ point vehicle. I like them, I really do... Just that even with 4 HP, they mostly just die to Melta appearing before they really get rolling or do much of anything. Yes, I did the DA LR of silliness with the (for them ) IC Techmarine giving the 4++ save and repairs from inside the vehicle... DAMN expensive and while it usually worked for what it was, there were several instances of if simply being killed by say, a Necron Chariot fly by... Lacking however the IC status on my bloody Iron Priest and the 4++ save? Not yet... Maybe in a big enough game where I can realistically protect the tank...
OK, enough random long term planning, back to the game at hand... Still not a lot of heavy anti tank, nor do I really have an answer for the fliers other than trying to outlast them... I do think with the limits in the league I WILL have enough AT firepower, it is mostly the AAA that I am concerned about... Though I guess I can hope they bring an Aegis line and just walk on to steal the gun... Or that time runs out...
Friday, April 5, 2013
Claws = Crap for Wolves?
:-) Yeah, trying hard to rebuild my ancient Wolves army... Finding the running theme of Claw = Crap though.
So, Blood Claws, I can have up to 15 crappy Marines. Iff I have 15, I can get a second Special Weapon, but I shoot WORSE than IG. At least around here, Vet Squads hit the field a lot... I can get a single Power Weapon... Yea? Oh, and unless I have them on leashes the give up their shooting attacks and try to charge. I can get a special character... But wait, the rules for Loki or Lukas do not actually work until he is alone or in a Challenge. They didn't work in 5th either, which led me to question whether the designers actually play the game... To create a unit with so many special rules and a really nice miniature only to find out that it is massively overpriced (in game, $ wise I was fine with the figure) and confusing as the special rules were things that will NEVER actually occur in the course of a normal game... In the edition the book was written in at least. Now, well, he is a Character and so can Challenge/Accept Challenges... So on the off chance you field them, AND he survives long enough to actually get into HtH, etc... Eh. Guessing I'll never see it actually fielded...
Sky Claws are overpriced Jump Infantry, and Swift Claws are overpriced Bikers... Guess the bikes at least suck less. Irks me as I still have the Jump Troops from 2nd edition, and I REALLY like Jump Troops... Just that they have the Blood Claw disadvantages... In one FAQ I WAS able to give a Wolf Guard a Jump Pack and assign him to the squad... Then it got erased a few days later... So, I can have wild berserkers on their own OR I could spend a bunch of points on an actual Character to kind of keep them in line until they get killed off.. Eh at best...
Wolf Claws? So re-rolling either the to hit or to Wound... I think I can honestly say I almost never use them as anything other than "Lightning Claws" for the re-roll on to wound, but... Not horrible, but I'm having a hard time seeing it as worth it :-)... A shame, I really like the weapon, just seldom use them, especially as they are AP 3 and by and large preclude shooting which the Wolves actually do quite well... NOT as well as my Grey Knights, whose "claws" do not in fact prevent the shooting...
:-) Painting coming along... Grey Hunters are actually looking "tabletop good"... Fur actually looks like fur, and fully painted army is looking possible... The vehicles on the other hand... Well, I have a LONG way to go on that...
So, Blood Claws, I can have up to 15 crappy Marines. Iff I have 15, I can get a second Special Weapon, but I shoot WORSE than IG. At least around here, Vet Squads hit the field a lot... I can get a single Power Weapon... Yea? Oh, and unless I have them on leashes the give up their shooting attacks and try to charge. I can get a special character... But wait, the rules for Loki or Lukas do not actually work until he is alone or in a Challenge. They didn't work in 5th either, which led me to question whether the designers actually play the game... To create a unit with so many special rules and a really nice miniature only to find out that it is massively overpriced (in game, $ wise I was fine with the figure) and confusing as the special rules were things that will NEVER actually occur in the course of a normal game... In the edition the book was written in at least. Now, well, he is a Character and so can Challenge/Accept Challenges... So on the off chance you field them, AND he survives long enough to actually get into HtH, etc... Eh. Guessing I'll never see it actually fielded...
Sky Claws are overpriced Jump Infantry, and Swift Claws are overpriced Bikers... Guess the bikes at least suck less. Irks me as I still have the Jump Troops from 2nd edition, and I REALLY like Jump Troops... Just that they have the Blood Claw disadvantages... In one FAQ I WAS able to give a Wolf Guard a Jump Pack and assign him to the squad... Then it got erased a few days later... So, I can have wild berserkers on their own OR I could spend a bunch of points on an actual Character to kind of keep them in line until they get killed off.. Eh at best...
Wolf Claws? So re-rolling either the to hit or to Wound... I think I can honestly say I almost never use them as anything other than "Lightning Claws" for the re-roll on to wound, but... Not horrible, but I'm having a hard time seeing it as worth it :-)... A shame, I really like the weapon, just seldom use them, especially as they are AP 3 and by and large preclude shooting which the Wolves actually do quite well... NOT as well as my Grey Knights, whose "claws" do not in fact prevent the shooting...
:-) Painting coming along... Grey Hunters are actually looking "tabletop good"... Fur actually looks like fur, and fully painted army is looking possible... The vehicles on the other hand... Well, I have a LONG way to go on that...
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